Posted by Tina
The Christian and Jewish religions have been shoved out of the classrooms and schools in America over the past few decades. Athiests and others scream, “separation of church and state” whenever anyone dares to suggest a prayer or religious song should be included in school activities. Lately Christians have begun to fight back. But it seems to me that some religions, including atheism, don’t have to fight for the right for the religious themes they prefer to find expression in our schools. So I was curious when I read the story below. Will objections be raised over a Muslim song being sung by a Colorado school choir?
A Colorado high school student quit the school choir after an Islamic song containing the lyric “there is no other truth except Allah” made it into the repertoire.
James Harper, a senior at Grand Junction High School in Grand Junction, put his objection to singing “Zikr,” a song written by Indian composer A.R. Rahman, in an email to Mesa County School District 51 officials. When the school stood by choir director Marcia Wieland’s selection, Harper quit.
“I don’t want to come across as a bigot or a racist, but I really don’t feel it is appropriate for students in a public high school to be singing an Islamic worship song,” Harper told KREX-TV. “This is worshipping another God, and even worshipping another prophet … I think there would be a lot of outrage if we made a Muslim choir say Jesus Christ is the only truth.”
But district spokesman Jeff Kirtland defended the decision to include the song.
“Choral music is often devoted to religious themes. … This is not a case where the school is endorsing or promoting any particular religion or other non-educational agenda. The song was chosen because its rhythms and other qualities would provide an opportunity to exhibit the musical talent and skills of the group in competition, not because of its religious message or lyrics,” Kirtland told FoxNews.com in an email while noting that the choir “is a voluntary, after-school activity.”
Hmmm….”there is no other truth except Allah” is considered an acceptable religious theme but “bless us oh Lord for these thy gifts” or “one nation under God” are not accetable religious themes?
I feel for the educators that must put up with such nonsense…but I can’t see allowing this Muslim song as long as other similar “themes” are going to be disallowed.
Not much commenting lately. I wonder why.
To an enlightened sensibility, the pronouncements of Jehovah, Allah and the Buddha are all one. And attempts to differentiate are, alas, bigotry.
I remember singing songs in high school choir which included lyrics praising Jesus. Sometimes the director would change the lyrics, other times she wouldn’t and a couple of students ended up choosing to sit out of a certain song because they weren’t comfortable with the lyrics. I’m really not sure if requiring choir students to sing a song with religious lyrics amounts to a violation of their religious freedom. It is an extra-curricular activity, it’s voluntary, and they are involved in an artistic performance. In an artistic performance not every word is meant to be taken literally. That said, if I were this director and one of my students felt this uncomfortable about this song, I would see if I could change the lyrics, and if that wasn’t ideal I’d just find a new song. Teachers should be sensitive to issues like this, she shouldn’t just do what she wants to do and end up making a kid feel excluded and pressured to quit.
I don’t know if this is a constitutional issue. Have there been cases of court decisions ruling that school choirs can’t force students to sing songs with religious themes? I think the voluntary and performative nature of choir makes it different from other classroom settings. Direct proselytizing would obviously still be forbidden but I don’t think this falls into that category.
Tina: “But it seems to me that some religions, including atheism, don’t have to fight for the right for the religious themes they prefer to find expression in our schools.”
What do you mean? Atheism isn’t a religion, and I haven’t heard that atheists have the right to tell their students “there is no God” in the public school classroom.
“Hmmm….”there is no other truth except Allah” is considered an acceptable religious theme but “bless us oh Lord for these thy gifts” or “one nation under God” are not accetable religious themes?”
“One nation under God” is still said every day during the flag salute at public schools, so that clearly is still an acceptable religious theme.
Oh we get lots of comments, not all of them are printable. For example this one that just arrived and it was for a story on Afghanistan from 2 years ago… now I have no way of knowing, but I suspect this person has a vested interested in Afghanistan, Iran, Pakistan, Iraq, etc. Maybe relatives live there?
AMERICANS ARE (censored) F-‘D IN THE BRAIN FROM THE SMALL TO THE THE BIGGEST WARS IT IS CAUSED ALL BY THERE FOREIGH POLICES. IF WE (censored) F-N STAY OUT OF THESE COUNTRIES HOW THE (censored) F WILL WE OPERATE OUR OWN ECONOMY WHEN 85 PERCENT OR SO IS ALL DEP ON OIL. MAKIN WAR OF COURSE TAKES CARES OF THESE NEEDS AND THE MILLIONS OF PEOPLE THAT DIE WHO GIVES A (censored) F…..(censored) F AMERICA AND THEIR WE STAND ON GOD SLOGAN….(censored) B-S I AM BORN AS AN AMERICAN CITIZEN BUT I MIGHT AS WELL SHOVE MY HEAD IN A (censored) F-N HOLE AS WERE NOTING BUT LOSERS!!!
Chris you make valid points about your experience with the choir, however I disagree on one point. If I were the teacher I would not be inclined to change the lyrics, this would be akin to plastering pants on Michael A’s David or hanging a bra on the Venus D’…we should respect the artist and the art. Some people feel uncomfortable views nudes in the museum, but it’s a free choice not to see them. For most of us, we are not so hypersensitive and we get to appreciate the art as it was crafted. -Jack
Tina, I totally agree with your premise. If it’s good for the goose its good for the gander. Period. Excellent find!
I also think that classical music should not come into censorship, that’s a slippery slope. There are some modern day rap songs extolling rape that are not suitable for the classroom or young children, but wouldn’t censor them for society. I leave that up to society when they choose to listen or not.
Libby: “Not much commenting lately. I wonder why.”
Could be we are all sick to death of the BS…could be the real news is being sugar coated or simply unreported.
What do you think? (seriously)
“To an enlightened sensibility, the pronouncements of Jehovah, Allah and the Buddha are all one.”
I used to share this theory. After becoming enlightened I realized it was just another can’t we all get along position.
“And attempts to differentiate are, alas, bigotry.”
Nonesense…it is simply a choice of one over the others based on information and faith.
Chris: “I’m really not sure if requiring choir students to sing a song with religious lyrics amounts to a violation of their religious freedom.”
The courts have come down on the side of allowing religious songs to be sung in case after case. What I find interesting is the number of cases that have been filed attempting to remove them:
http://aclj.org/christmas-holiday/holiday-observance-in-public-schools
I don’t think anyone should be forced to sing a song they personally find offensive. If during school hours let them take a study hall or let them sit out if only one piece is offensive. Schools can handle these things IF people will just use some common sense and tolerance.
The only reason I brought it up is because the Christian religion has been questioned in school activities and function so often over the past few decades and it’s time we learned what is in the constitution regarding the seperation issue. If we are going to allow religious material we should allow all religious material.
I think it’s good for students to learn about other religions.
“What do you mean? Atheism isn’t a religion, and I haven’t heard that atheists have the right to tell their students “there is no God” in the public school classroom.”
Christianity has been shoved out of the public schools. It started back in the sixties when some group decided singing Christian music in school glee clubs and choirs might offend people of the Jewish faith. A lot of traditional Christmas music was dropped. Jingle Bells and songs like that were acceptable.
Atheism may not be called a religion but it is a religion of the self or ego since a higher power is not recognized. This may be the problem atheist have with “in God we trust” and pledging the flag.
Quite a number of teachers have been made gaia like a god in the classroom through their teaching about global warming.
“”One nation under God” is still said every day during the flag salute at public schools, so that clearly is still an acceptable religious theme.”
And still it is being challenged in court costing school districts money and time.
Maybe that’s the point of this post. Decisions by teachers and school administrators have worked pretty well through the years when common sense is applied. I hope and pray that the masses will finally stand up to frivilous of offense, particularly those waged in the courts.
Good points as well, Jack, although I think there is a difference between “censorship” and changing a couple lyrics or lines in order to make a performance jive better with the performers and the audience. But you should always be careful about what you take out and what you leave in. Sometimes you just have to conclude that a certain performance isn’t right for a specific community.
For instance, a friend of mine from high school is directing the school play at our alma mater this year. It’s her first time directing and for some reason she chose to put on “Hairspray.” It’s a great play with a great message, but for a city with virtually zero black community whatsoever, it was a questionable choice to do a play which deals so heavily with racial segregation. As far as I’m aware there are no African-American students in the play, and the majority of the performers are Hispanic. Race-blind casting is usually OK, but why do a play specifically about conflicts between two different races if most of your performers are visibly not of either of those two races? Furthermore, she is cutting out a ridiculous amount of lines deemed inappropriate. I remember lines being cut or changed when I was in school plays, but never this much. Also, Edna, a character who is intended to be played by a man in drag, is being played by a female in this production because the director didn’t think she’d be able to find any willing boys to play the part. I’m left wondering why she chose this play to begin with if she knew so many deviations from the source were going to have to be made.
The director of the school in this article may have also simply picked the wrong song for her community, but she’s chosen to stick by her decision. Personally, I think the students have to come first. More directors and teachers in general need to think more about what’s right for their students, and not just about what they want.
The student was given the option to not sign the song while staying in the choir. He chose to leave.
The courts have ruled on this and sided with the schools because it is classified as art and not religion.
The school administrators and board did follow the law according to the below. (Interesting, all of the other news links quoted Fox News. Couldn’t find another news agency covering the story.)
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/02/15/colorado-student-reportedly-quits-choir-over-islamic-song/
Another story is in the news today. This time in Rhode Island a single athiest student (and the local branch of the ACLU) won in court to have a 49 year old prayer banner, donated by the class of ’63, removed from the high school. She said since she doesn’t believe in “the Heavenly Father” she “shouldn’t have to look at it” and was “thrilled” that she won.
This kid is a junior! She can’t manage a little tolerance, or simply avert her eyes, for another year and a half? Incredible!
The school caved rather than pay for more court expenses and who can blame them? This is so sad. Schools have enough stuff to deal with every year without having to indulge a single students petty indignation.
But, you have to hand it to her parents; they have raised a typical progressive control freak. No doubt she will go on to bigger things.
Find the story here:
http://dailycaller.com/2012/02/17/aclu-atheist-teen-cheer-decision-to-remove-school-prayer-banner/
“Could be we are all sick to death of the BS…”
You mean, like that Levin post? Or the Central Bank post? Or the Napolitano post? Dreary, and quite ignorant, nonsense, all of it.
Dismissive, as usual.
Why don’t you submit something for us that you think is better.
Well, I could link to the Republican-Arizona-sheriff Romney-campaign-chair who threatened to have his non-citizen (and, alas, male) lover deported.
But I won’t.
Someday you all are going to admit that you are just as nutsy as everybody else. There is no superior ideology. All that needs doing is to sack and/or imprison (depending on the severity of the abuse … that lunch-confiscating-school-official was out of line) those who abuse the power granted them by the body politic.
That really is all that needs doing.
Tina, something called a “prayer banner” should of course not be hung in a public school. That’s just common sense. Unlike a song performed by a choir for its artistic value, a prayer banner is a clear government endorsement of religion, which is illegal and unconstitutional. This girl was 100% right to have it taken down. It should have been taken down years ago; the school is lucky that they haven’t had a lawsuit leveled against them before this. Far from being a “control freak,” this girl recognizes her constitutional rights and stood up for them. Your objection to her actions, and the similar objections I’ve read from other conservatives on this and similar issues, is one of the many reasons I often doubt the sincerity of Tea Party members when they claim to stand for the Constitution.