by Jack
“As I have stated strongly before, and just to reiterate, if Turkey does anything that I, in my great and unmatched wisdom, consider to be off limits, I will totally destroy and obliterate the Economy of Turkey (I’ve done it before!). They must, with Europe and others, watch over “the captured ISIS fighters and families. The U.S. has done far more than anyone could have ever expected, including the capture of 100% of the ISIS Caliphate. It is time now for others in the region, some of great wealth, to protect their own territory. THE USA IS GREAT!” President Donald Trump
If I have deciphered this tweet correctly, Trump is saying if Turkey wages war on the Kurds or if they invade Syria, they can expect economic sanctions from the US. As for watching over the captured Isis terrorists and their families, this is a little more clear. It is in reference to the cost of keeping terrorists and their families in camps. This is creating a serious cost burden for the US. In many cases the country of origins for these Isis thugs don’t want them back. In the recent past, Trump has threatened to force repatriation.
Now this from Business Insider – 15 minutes ago: “Turkey is a member of the NATO alliance, making it highly unusual for the US president to threaten economic war on an ally. Trump rebuked the Turkish and European governments and suggested they weren’t shouldering enough of the responsibilities in fighting the Islamic State.
“”It is time now for others in the region, some of great wealth, to protect their own territory,” Trump tweeted.
“The Turkish economy has been in the midst of a year-long recession with a battered currency and high inflation. Economists say the Turkish economy will contract 0.3 percent this year after a decade of strong growth. It’s not clear what actions Trump could take against the NATO ally.”
President Erdogan of Turkey is a dictator and he is fast approaching being a Muslim hardliner in defiance to Turkey’s secular status. So, it’s highly unlikely that he will be moved by anything Trump threatens. However, it could strain diplomatic relations to the point that we lose our two air bases in Turkey. Incirlik is the main base. It employs 5,000 airmen which includes Turkish and British Airmen. The second base, Izmir, is more for NATO purposes, however Americans are also stationed there and we’ve done most of the construction and upkeep. It would be a huge loss if we were evicted from these bases.
Erdogan has been a political figure for decades and more recently increasingly a religious nut-case. But, until he achieved power in 2014 (he was voted in as President), he was a minor irritant to US policies. Now, after his election and his strong hold on power he has started undermining free press and free speech and other Constitutional guarantees. Four years after his election key military leaders attempted a coup that failed and now he’s become just another Muslim dictator.
It’s safe to say that Erdogan has never been a friend of the US, but with President Trump the relations have become extremely stressed. Where this will end up is anyone’s guess. But, I don’t like the prospects for equitable resolution.
For more on this breaking story, please follow this link.
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Is anyone getting the least little bit worried that Trump really is a megalomaniac? I have to admit, he’s got me worried. As I close Trumps famous last words still echo in my mind…”…. in my great and unmatched wisdom, …. I will totally destroy and obliterate”
Re “It would be a huge loss if we were evicted from these bases.”
It would also be a huge economic loss to Turkey if this Islamo-fascist thug Erdogan evicted US bases, not to mention any other resulting sanctions. Turkey is a wimpy, corrupt, facade of a ****hole Islamic country compared to the US. Let them evict us and see what happens. Let Erdogan plant the seeds of his own destruction. I welcome Erdogan’s potential evictions. It will be his undoing.
By the way, did you Jack (or anyone else) know how much Oliver Stone’s film “Midnight Express” severely damaged Turkey’s economics (heavily dependent then on tourism and still so today) back in the late 70’s and 80s? A MOVIE destroyed their tourism business. They are a fragile farce with much to lose.
Is anyone getting the least little bit worried that Trump really is a megalomaniac? I have to admit, he’s got me worried. As I close Trumps famous last words still echo in my mind…”…. in my great and unmatched wisdom, …. I will totally destroy and obliterate”
Hold on to that feeling, Jack. Don’t lose it. The man is insane, and he’s always been this way. He is not fit to be president. See why we want to impeach him?
We need to figure out how to keep that senile A-Hole off the phone for the next year … is what we need to do. Back to back rallies?! All the senile a-holes can THERE amuse themselves, and NOT bother the rest of us.
We suspected it – and now it’s confirmed!
https://www.nationalreview.com/news/fbis-foreign-surveillance-program-violated-americans-civil-liberties-fisa-court-finds/
Turkey is invading Syria today to begin an ethnic cleansing of the Christian Kurds, our allies, days after Trump withdrew troops.
America under Trump is a country that betrays its allies and allows genocide. And there’s little evidence that the president made this move for any reason other than to change the news cycle.
This stain will never come clean.
Chris there is strong evidence that this could create a void that will be filled once again by ISIS fighters, like it was in Iraq. Time will tell, but right off we are looking really bad to our Kurdish friends and allies. I feel very uncomfortable with Trump’s decision here.
Pie here Jack. We will see what develops. I am making no predictions.
Pie here: Of course Chris would see it this way. Yet Erdogan’s adventure could mean the demise of Erdogan. The Turkish President has been invading Syria for years, the only change it that he has now made a formal declaration of war. I see this as a very bad move on Erodan’s part.
Given the fact Turkey has been running soldiers, artillery and infantry in and out of Syria for years, Chris’ complaint implies that if the US stays in the region it would ultimately be to seek a war with Turkey in order to to defend Assad, not merely to defend Kurds.
I daresay, that with some help from the US, the Kurds will prevail. Chris assertion that “there’s little evidence that the president made this move for any reason other than to change the news cycle” has no evidence at all. It is merely specious, politically motivated bull**** coming from a **** slinger.
The evidence is that virtually no one in his administration or even party supported this move. There did not seem to be any plan, again. And the president’s primary obsession–as seen in his constant tweeting–is the coverage he gets from the media. Put it all together, and it is not hard to believe that this move was meant to change the news cycle. Now, I do not know that this is the reason, but there is evidence that this could be the reason.
Pie here: This week’s award for Creative False Narrative in the Trump Derangement Syndrome Class goes to Chris.
There’s nothing creative about it. Trump’s motives are never complex. But it’s more likely Trump made this move after being promised something by Erdogan, or because it benefits his financial interests in Turkey (he has a Trump Tower there). This is how he operates. Note how he constantly rails against China’s economic exploitation of the US but never has a thing to say about their human rights abuses. He really does believe that money is more important than people. This is not “mind reading,” this is the only plausible conclusion when observing his decades of public behavior and statements. This week should have eliminated any doubt: the president bases US policy, both foreign and domestic, not on what is in the best interests of the American people, but on his own personal, political, and financial interests. And we warned you.
George Will: The Republican party under Trump is “supine, docile, invertebrate”
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/watch/george-f-will-on-trump-the-republican-party-is-docile-supine-and-invertebrate/vp-AAItiKv
Hey guys, we only had about 50 soldiers there. We’re not talking about pulling out thousands of troops. Time will tell, but I think Erdogan made a big mistake, if he doesn’t change course and soon.
Also, did you guys see this? Could it be connected to why Trump is pulling out?
Kurdish Militia Trained Antifa Fighters In Northern Syria: video
https://www.oann.com/kurdish-militia-trained-antifa-fighters-in-northern-syria/
Re “Hey guys, we only had about 50 soldiers there. We’re not talking about pulling out thousands of troops. Time will tell, but I think Erdogan made a big mistake, if he doesn’t change course and soon.”
Peggy, a voice for calm sanity in a hand wringing, hyperbolic world.
Pie.
By the way Peggy, linking to OAN is sure to draw fire from Chris given his penchant for attacking the messenger and not the message. He rigorously follows that age old progressive bromide, when you cannot deploy reason, knowledge and rational thought to an issue, launch a personal attack.
Chris is a progressive child who posts to attack and offend those he disagrees with.
Didn’t you love the picture of Ellen DeGeneres and George Bush together at the ball game and her remarks about her friendship with him? Bet Chris was one of those from his party who hated it.
Bad assumption, Peggy. I thought the outrage from parts of the left toward Ellen was ridiculous, and said so on Twitter. I’ll show you the tweets if you want.
Pie I am so glad to see you are still in the fight. I’ve been worried about you, but knowing you are still with us makes me feel better. I don’t know what to do about this Trump business anymore, on one hand I generally support his ideas, but on the other hand, the man drives me crazy with his un-presidential behaviors. I had hoped he would dial it back some, but he’s gotten worse. Then again so has the conspiracy to undermine his presidency. I don’t like what the dems are doing, it smells.
What’s your take? Do we support Trump because he’s being attacked relentlessly by the deep state, but most of his policy ideas are pretty good? I like lower taxes, controlling our Southern border, fair trade rules, a fair China policy, oil independence, etc. I’m just trying to figure out where the person and the persona divide, who’s the real Trump?
I like lower taxes, controlling our Southern border, fair trade rules, a fair China policy, oil independence, etc.
Mike Pence would do all this and also not publicly embarrass himself and the nation every day. Just sayin’.
How can you separate a man’s views from his behaviors? The latter reflect the former … unless you’re a hypocrite.
As to this:
“I like lower taxes (greed & civic irresponsibility), controlling our Southern border (xenophobia), fair trade rules, a fair China policy (trade wars that put small business OUT OF BUSINESS!), oil independence (then why are you eternally yowling about economic incentives to green technology !!!), etc.
You plainly don’t know WHAT you like.
Libby, please quit trying to be a mind reader, focus on your day job, you will have more success. Same could be said for putting words into other people’s mouth.
Libby, this may come as a total shock to you, but civic responsibility does not mean loving high taxes. In fact it could easily be argued that its just the reverse. CA has super high taxes, highest in the nation – how’s that working out for us? Where’s this tax money going Libby, into a rat hole? How has your definition of civic responsibility worked in Oakland, San Francisco or Los Angeles? Let me clue you in, it’s led to bums, trash, rats, poop on the sidewalks, filth and diseases we’ve not seen for a 100 years. Your side is flush with stupid. You got more greed, malpractice, exploitation and corruption than any conservative state in history.
When you wise up maybe we can have an honest dialog?
Jack, money don’t fix everything, but you CANNOT do diddly without it. And there are VERY strong arguments that Reaganomic Strangulation of the Public Purse has landed us where we are today, with thousands of crazies living on the streets.
But effective laws help too. I just read that SF and LA are embarking on a pilot conservatorship program for the intransigently homeless. We will see how that goes.
You should see me in my Betty Boop long underwear, Lippy. Very manly.
Re Chris America under Trump is a country that betrays its allies and allows genocide. And there’s little evidence that the president made this move for any reason other than to change the news cycle. This stain will never come clean.
This comment from Chris is particularly interesting given his history of rabid support for and repeated rationalization of Obama’s policies in the Middle East a scant few years back. Chris is quite amusing when fancies himself some sort of super-hero fighting those dastardly hypocrites (for the most part imagined) in Post Scripts yet is completely oblivious to his own blatant hypocrisy. It is a remarkable character flaw and evidently one he will never recognize as he appears to lack any capacity for self reflection and evaluation. Like his mentor Quentin Colgan before him, Chris has this absolutely wonderful and enormous blind spot.
Chris wears many hats — Adept psychic, masterly psychoANALyst, overlord of true morality, champion of the self-righteous, impassioned warrior for social justice, perfervid pugilist promoting and propagandizing all causes progressive and he is a distinguished unintentional comedian.
Chris never fails to tickle my funny bone.
What hypocrisy? Explain it; you can’t. Trump’s withdrawal is nothing like Obama’s withdrawal from Iraq, for reasons that Jack and I agreed on yesterday, and which are quite obvious. Do you really need me to repeat them for you?
Another pant load from Chris. I have never said that Trump’s withdrawal is similar to Obama’s withdrawl from Iraq. Not anything of the kind. Nevertheless, evidently Obama gets a pass from Chris because he had a timetable (OH MY!) for withdrawal which resulted in the horrible ISIS invasion.
Why is Chris are always inventing what I have said? What is wrong with him? Is English his second language? (Actually, these are rhetorical questions, see *Note below.)
I never said the withdrawals were similar. I called Chris a hypocrite for being an Obama lick-spittle and supporting and defending his regrettable, half-baked and failed mid east policies and then condemning Trump for exiting northern Syria, the results of which are yet to be seen.
1) Obama abandoned Iraq and we all know the result. What difference did it make that he abandoned it on a “timetable?” The awful result of that questionable abandonment is inarguable.
2) Chris is a moron who supports one abandonment (because it was on a timetable from a President he kisses the *** of) and condemns another (because it was Trump whom he hates).
3) By the way, where is the “genocide” of “Christian Kurds” Chris has predicted? Ergodan seems a bit slow on the uptake.
*Note: The above questions are rhetorical because Chris invents what I say so he can argue a fantasy straw man instead of trying to argue what I have actually said. This is standard practice for Chris and progressives in general, not to mention Democrats. It serves to deflect, obscure, conflate, confuse and waste time and space. Which is his purpose in Post Scripts and on the planet.
You were, of course, referring to Obama’s withdrawal from Iraq, as you literally confirm in the very same comment in which you are trying to deny it. Your claim that “Obama abandoned Iraq” is, of course, a lie, for reasons I have already explained; Obama tried and failed to negotiate a longer stay in Iraq. The fact that Obama withdrew on a timetable, set before his administration even began, agreed to by our allies, of course makes all the difference when comparing it to a president who betrayed our allies by withdrawing troops on a whim, without even consulting the Pentagon. To accuse me of “hypocrisy” for condemning Trump’s withdrawal when I did not condemn Obama’s Iraq withdrawal is, of course, nonsense, for the reasons articulated above. To act as if I never criticized Obama’s foreign policy on these pages is, of course, a lie.
You are really, really bad at this.
Pie here: Another false narrative from Chris. Will Chris ever apologize for his lies?
Pie Here: Obama apologist and lickspittle Chris defends Obama’s abandonment of Iraq. Talks with Iraq about the withdrawal date collapsed not because Obama “tried and failed” but because he did not even try. He proposed a delay and then completely caved to the inept government Bush left behind. It was an empty show. The operative word here is Obama “failed” and we all know the result of Obama’s failure to lead.
This latest blatantly hypocritical absurdity from Chris smacks of the Lickspittle Liar’s amazing assertion that Obama did not lie about keeping your doctor and health plan in the disaster health care plan that carried his name because he did not know! Well, what can you expect from a ridiculous person who treats his own mother like ****.