Posted by Tina
Los Angeles County Superior Court Judge Rolf M. Treu has rules that tenure for teachers is unconstitutional because they harm low-income and minority students stuck in classrooms with incompetent teachers:
The protections “impose a real and appreciable impact on students’ fundamental right to equality of education,” he wrote. “The evidence is compelling. Indeed, it shocks the conscience.”
The judges decision ends the practice of laying off teachers based on when they were hired and eliminates the 18 month tenure process. He also wrote that the practice harms teachers who are forced to work with “poor performing colleagues and the district that is forced to wastes dollars on expensive dismissive cases.:
If layoffs become necessary, teacher performance should matter, he said. When a high-quality junior teacher is laid off instead of a lesser, more experienced colleague, “the result is classroom disruption on two fronts,” he wrote. It’s a “lose-lose situation” that “is unfathomable and therefore constitutionally unsupportable.”
The verdict is being criticized by state and local teachers union. Supporters acknowledged the appeals process and indicated they won’t wait for the courts to fight it out:
“We should not and cannot afford to wait for the appellate courts to address these critical issues,” said Josephine Lucey, the president of the California School Boards Assn., adding that the education community should “immediately begin working with the governor and the California Legislature to resolve these important issues of inequality in education.”
The lawsuit was filed on behalf of “a well-funded Silicon Valley group.”
As if the union wasn’t also “well-funded?”
No, no … not unconstitutional. But unconscionable.
This will blow your minds, but I concur. I can’t sympathize; they brought it on themselves. The rank and file have known full well for easily forty years that the regs shield incompetents and, selfishly, they wouldn’t turn a hair.
They’re gonna pay for it now … and they owe.
There will be a great wave of political carnage, from the wreckage of which, they will have to rebuild … with modifications, one hopes.
I am going all Armageddon, aren’t I? We’re having issues down here in my neighborhood. We, the citizens, have voted to close the only public hospital for 50 miles. They wanted another couple, five, eight hundred from everybody, depending on your square footage, on top of several previous grantings of tax revenue … but this would only bring the monthly running deficit of $1.5M down to $1.2M.
No. Something is seriously, horribly wrong. So we are just going to shut the puppy down … and start over.
Libby you blew my mind more over the hospital issue…we taxpayers should get bang for our hard earned bucks. Good for you! I do hope you find a better alternative in the new model.
I was a bit skeptical about the judges reference to the Constitution as well. He has to believe that education is a “right” which of course it isn’t. It is a responsibility of the parents and they should work within their communities to see that their children are well served. Our communities too have a vested interest in making sure our kids get a good education. It’s foolish to tolerate anything but excellence in education for every child. You’re right, it’s time this thing blew.
“He has to believe that education is a “right” which of course it isn’t.”
Of course it is … comes under the heading “promote the general Welfare”.
Libby, the phrase “to promote the general welfare” is so broad you can fit almost anything you want into it…good or not so good. So, you have to read it in the context of the times in which it was written and not embellish it. The people back in the day didn’t want government running their daily lives, right? Of course they felt government should help them prosper and be healthy whenever the opportunity presented itself, but they also didn’t want government to interfere and control them anymore than was absolutely necessary. A delicate balance that we struggle with today.
We have always had certain inalienable rights that empower us to do many things for ourselves. We have the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Those are our rights, anything else is just something the people decided that they needed, but were not necessarily a right. A right is a very exclusive thing that can’t be granted by mankind nor taken away by mankind and this is a very important point. I hope this clears up what a right is?
Wow, my first reaction to this judge was he understands his fiduciary responsibility is to see that the public’s funds go to benefit the students and not the staff, instructors and administrators.
Even though I worked in the public sector for over 20 years and was even the union president for four years and a member of the negotiations team for over 15 years I was not a supporter of the seniority system and wanted the merit system instead.
The college I worked at and a couple of teachers my sons had should have been shown the door years before instead of being retained while far better teachers were let go.
LOL “a delicate balance that we struggle with today” I see a huge bag of BS (government incursions) on one side and a feather on the other.
It amazes me more and more how if we rolled back the clock 50 years I would have a lot in common with those people who wanted nothing to do with big government or “the man”. Who were those people and where did they go? Oddly enough they became what they hated and they are far worse than anything they ever protested. I wonder if that ever occurs to them?
This is hysterical and equally sad. But, it explains why we have a Democrat controlled state legislation and repeatedly send two Democrat senators to DC.
What’s Your State’s Average IQ? New Map Purports to Have the Answer:
“A California based real-estate group has released a map that purports to show the average IQ levels of individuals in each state.
Movoto said in a blog post that they analyzed 500,000 unique tweets from around the country to compose the map, using a computer algorithm to score tweets based on spelling, grammar and word choice.
The group found that California, New Mexico and Mississippi were among the states with the lowest average level of intelligence.
On the other end? Montana, North Dakota, Minnesota, New Hampshire and Massachusetts were among states with the highest IQ’s.”
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/06/11/whats-your-states-average-iq-new-map-purports-to-have-the-answer/
#5 Peggy
Hi Peggy,
I’m curious as to what a merit pay system for teachers would look like. What are your thoughts on this issue? I did a quick Google search “Merit pay and teachers” and found several states that have had major issues with tying pay to student academic performance. Two such cases happened in Texas and in Atlanta. In Texas when Houston Superintendent of Schools Rod Paige implemented student assessment standards for teachers and administrators pay (The model for “No Child Left Behind”), it was later found that some teachers and school administrators cheated to increase student performance. (Houston schools went so far as to proclaim a 100% high school graduation rate. No students failed, dropped out, or otherwise had any issue that kept them from graduating?) In Atlanta, a “right to work” state, which means no tenure, administrators and teachers flat out cheated on student tests. They changed student answers to make themselves look better. If I were a teacher, without tenure, I’d have a difficult time saying “No, I’m not going to cheat.” to a principal that could fire me for any reason.
So, what needs to happen to retain “good” teachers and weed out the “bad” teachers? What criteria do we use to show that a “good” teacher deserves a pay raise? Do we leave this decision to a principal? Do we leave this decision to a parent? I don’t have a clue on how to fix the situation, but I do know that one cannot compare the private sector working conditions and compensation packages to that of a teacher’s working conditions and compensation packages. The private sector will see real time results of their employee performance in the way of sales and teachers will not. Teachers have to wait eighteen or more years to see the fruits of their labor.
Have you got any suggestions? I don’t have a clue on how to resolve the issues of merit pay and tenure for teachers. Maybe we could look at what other countries have implemented?
Thanks,
Pete
Libby: “Of course it is … comes under the heading “promote the general Welfare”.
Promote does not mean establish and run. Lefties want to make it a right, instead of a responsibility of parents, because they want to control what is taught and how its taught.
We tried the experiment; it failed.
Peggy, twitter tweets are not a valid indication of anything … anything … at all. So you shouldn’t let this “analysis” distress you … at all.
Tina, you want to be a tool of the fascists in this land trying to dismantle public education … peachy.
Just know, that we know, that’s what you are.
The rest of us will commence to make improvements, to create an institutional structure wherein English teachers who put their student to busy work, sit back, and tweet … these teachers get sacked.
Pete raises some excellent points. I have mixed feelings on tenure–I had a HORRIBLE professor in college who was also somehow the head of the credential program, and I’ll just say that every student of hers I’ve ever spoken to regards her as an embarrassment to the school. Thankfully she’s gone now, but I’ve been told it was a voluntary retirement. At the same time I see the value of tenure in protecting teachers who have put in the time and work to get it. And teaching is an incredibly hard thing to judge objectively and consistently.
Toby the average kid fifty years ago that was part of the anti-establishment crowd were just being kids and going with the flow of the volatile times.
The radicals that were pushing the envelope politically were anti-American. Their slogans were designed to cause chaos a vehicle to facilitate a revolution. Many of them were raised by communists.
They were not against government, just our form of government. A lot of them graduated and embedded in state, local and federal government positions and politics, in education, and in the legal arena. They trashed the hippie garb and cleaned up on the outside but are just as red as they were in college and have been undermining our system of government ever since. They are the ones that pushed hard for the big government bag of BS.
I doubt if you had been able to see through their anger with “the man” you would have had much in common with them. Have you ever read David Horowitz book, “Radical Son”…that book gives you the inside scoop on the radicals, their methods and intentions. I highly recommend it.
Libby: “you want to be a tool of the fascists in this land trying to dismantle public education”
WOW! You really are at the effect of that caraciture depicting what a conservative looks like!
Conservatives like to see things work but forcing solutions is always a bad idea! On the other hand government control, the model we have been using, is decidedly fascist…mirror?
“The rest of us will commence to make improvements, to create an institutional structure wherein English teachers who put their student to busy work, sit back, and tweet … these teachers get sacked.”
Think small and continue as always.
Its only taken fifty years and, finally, immense pressure from fed up parents, parents/teachers creating alternatives, plus a judges ruling to put you in that harumphy mood.
I think that competition thing, charter schools and home schooling is working to promote change. When teachers and schools know they have to compete and when teachers (and administrators) know they can be sacked, they get educated, work harder on the actual goal, and perform. The great thing about it? Its a win, win, win…students, teachers and our nation all benefit! Onward toward excellence!
You want to home school? Nobody’s telling you you can’t. Go to it.
The charter school movement has now been thoroughly discredited by “entrepreneurs” out to game the system and make a buck. But it’s still a popular option, so we’re stuck with the very expensive task of shutting down bad actors, one at a time.
Shall we expand the field a little and talk about the percentage of national student loan debt generated by “for profit” schools? … when these schools all too often leave students un-degreed and un-employable. No?
You and your conservative values do cost us money.
However, you will not be allowed to further damage the nation’s infrastructure of public education.
Libby thanks for thinking I’m young enough to be home schooling my kids but that wasn’t the point. The point was that home schoolers and charters are bringing attention to the problem and creating competition.
Yes some charters fail and need to be closed. Too bad the government controlled schools that are failing don’t meet the same fate…they have been allowed to continue for decades. The “shut down” process would be equally, if not more, expensive. (A similar private enterprise would be charged with racism).
Charges of entrepreneurs “out to make a buck” scream out…evidence please! I can show you evidence, and have, of charter schools with superior achievement records and very satisfied parents to balance out any that might fail.
Evidence that Charter Schools produce a superior result in Florida.
Even the US DOE agrees:
See also here:
The Courant:
I can do this all night long!
I have to tell you though, I know there are good public schools and there are wonderful public school teachers. The problem is that the politically correct atmosphere along with the union control of our schools has not been healthy and a lot of deserving kids have been severely wronged because of it.
Oh lets do expand into charter school students and college and college loan debt.
Huffington Post did a story back in February of 2011 about an all male Charter school in Chicago:
It’s nice to hear someone is doing something right in Chicago! Other dedicated people should study and recreate the model!
Here’s an example of the other end of the spectrum at public schools in Oregon:
Positive results for children should be the focus of whatever school children go to and when the school isn’t performing we should have a way to fix the problem. Parents represent the consumers in education. When all we had was the local public school they didn’t think they had any power and people without power are apathetic. give parents choice and they know they can play an active part in choosing the best school for their child. Their choice gives schools incentive to do better.
I couldn’t fins and article or study that addressed charter school loan debt but logically since there are fewer Charter Schools it would follow that student loan debt by charter school graduates would be a small percentage of the overall number.
Conservative values cost “us” money? What a complete disconnect!
Progressive values cost “us” in every single aspect of our lives…much of it spent on fat bureaucracies, fraud, and waste. Bureaucracies don’t educate, don’t heal, don’t insure, don’t build, and don’t make for better performance or result. That’s what happens when profit and excellence do not matter, the focus turns away from responsible management of dollars and results to more and bigger budgets regardless the result. I give you the VA and Obamacare as ongoing and more recent examples.
“,,,you will not be allowed to further damage the nation’s infrastructure of public education.”
Yeah, because everyone knows its the (government/union managed) “infrastructure” that matters not the kids! Not the satisfaction of parents and teachers.
Pathetic.
Tina, you can niggle all you like. I’m talking “Big Picture” here.
This nation rose to greatness on a solid foundation of public education, which can be, and will always be improved.
You, who would tear it down, will not succeed.
Libby you are such a pill. I am not doing a thing to “tear down” the public school system.
I am calling attention to the reasons that once excellent system is and has been failing and I am reporting on the measures that frustrated parents and teachers have taken to remedy the situation after years of frustration.
I have noticed that big government types like you would like to destroy perfectly good alternatives that work. How an you defend that position?
Change is hard I know. But change we will because the kids deserve better, because parents and good teachers are sick and tired of failure in the teaching profession, and because our nation is about success, not failure…we all want our kids to do well.
This nation rose to greatness because of a number of things. Poor international rankings and failing to meet the highest standards for all students isn’t one of them. Paying incompetent teachers for years while kids are poorly served is also not one of them!
Gosh Libs, your so stuck in the old system one might surmise that you’re rigid or something. I thought progressives were all about new ideas and progress.
It only took you four posts to back down. But we both know that the entities that feed you this blather have exactly the beggaring of the nation’s public schools as their object.
If you are too dim to see it, well, I will just continue to point it out to you.
Nobody’s advocating the abolition of charter schools. I just pointed out to you how the movement has been corrupted by capitalists … and that cleaning up is costing us … big time.
This ALWAYS happens when you let the private sector into the public domain. They take our money, we get pitiful and/or no service, and we have no recourse. The capitalist has taken his contract payments and … lord help us all … reincarnated into some other entity (but with the same Congressional Connections) … we is screwed again.
This really is just so annoying.
#8 Pete,
Try these links and see if you find the information to help you.
Merit system
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
“The merit system is the process of promoting and hiring government employees based on their ability to perform a job, rather than on their political connections. It is the opposite of the spoils system.
..Proponents of the system admit that the system does not always lead to the choice of most competent candidate but is effective in eliminating those most incompetent.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merit_system
Merit System Services:
http://www.mss.ca.gov/
“The Merit System was voted into the Del Norte County Unified School District in July, 1966 and became fully operational on July 1, 1967. Today there are approximately 100 merit system school districts in California. Together these districts employ almost 60% of the total classified (non-certificated) school employees in the state!”
https://sites.google.com/a/delnorte.k12.ca.us/human-resources/merit-system
Conejo Valley Unified School District
http://www.conejo.k12.ca.us/DISTRICTOFFICE/PERSONNELSERVICES/CLASSIFIEDPERSONNEL/MERITSYSTEM/TABID/388/DEFAULT.ASPX
California School Employees Association Merit System Standing:
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/2506569/California-School-Employees-Association–Merit-System-Standing
All of the above links are for classified employees, none are for certificated or administration.
Personally I see no reason teachers and administrators could not also fall under the merit system except for the push back the CTA and the individual contracts negotiated by administrators with school boards.
As I see it school boards are in control or they should be and school boards are elected by members of their communities. Instead we have unions endorsing school board member’s elections, therefore, bending to the will of the very people they are supposed to be supervising. School boards approve all pay raises, yet rely on the unions to get elected. This is not a win win for our students, but it sure pays out to teachers with tenor and top administrators who earn more than governors and the US president.
#10 Libby, Did you start drinking early today? Your comment was posted just past 4:00pm and I have no idea what the he77 you’re talking about.
#12 Chris, My youngest son had a 2nd grade teacher who refused to follow district policies on discipline. When I challenged her on her doing her own thing she retaliated on my son by refusing to call on him and putting his desk in the corner all by himself. When he told me what she’d done and that the other kids were afraid to play or even talk to him I went to the principle and demanded he be removed from her class and I’d go to the school board if I had to.
A couple of years later a girlfriend’s daughter got the same teacher. When another mother saw the teacher slap by friends daughter across the face all he77 broke lose and she finally agreed to retire. She wasn’t fired, she retired.
She messed up my son and my friends daughter for sure and there’s no telling how many others she harmed
both physically and emotionally. To this day all we have to do is mention her name for my son, who was a teacher for 13 years, to say she should have never been a teacher.
Pete, After reading the rest of the comments the only way I see teachers moving to the merit system is with vouchers and charter schools. The teachers union is too big and strong for it to be implemented.
If enough students use their vouchers for charter schools the enrollment in public schools would necessarily decline reducing the unions power with falling membership numbers and shrinking union dues. The unions of course figured this out years ago and have been against both vouchers and charter schools for their own self preservation.
Libby at #19 I’m Backing down? I’m the only one who has posted evidence to support my position and refute your unfounded accusations.
“Nobody’s advocating the abolition of charter schools”
Glad to hear it but you could have fooled me.
” I just pointed out to you how the movement has been corrupted by capitalist…”
Without any evidence of same to back it up.
“and that cleaning up is costing us … big time.”
Again, where is the evidence?
In fact I’d like to hear about these greedy capitalist schools that need to be “cleaned up” after; show me the dirty capitalist! Give me the chance to rail against him.
“This really is just so annoying.”
Yes, it is!
“#10 Libby, Did you start drinking early today? Your comment was posted just past 4:00pm and I have no idea what the he77 you’re talking about.”
Oh, put it in a sock and smoke it. If you don’t have anything constructive to offer … I mean, geez.
Come on … convince me of the virtue of an algorithmic analysis of twitter tweets to determine anything!
People who tweet, for the most, part “mean” nothing. Consequently, an analysis of this drivel can mean nothing. The piece wasn’t even intended to be taken seriously, but you, seemingly, did.
What are we going to do with you?