Universal Healthcare Reality Check

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30 Responses to Universal Healthcare Reality Check

  1. Libby says:

    Belgium manages just fine. You saying the Belgians can do something we can’t? That’s kinda pitiful, don’t you think?

    • Post Scripts says:

      Yes, we can do what Belgium does, IF…. we did not have a huge illegal immigrant population sucking up healthcare dollars and putting pennies back in. IF….persons earning between $17,000 and $25,000 a year paid 30% to income tax, while persons earning $25,000 to 40,000 paid 40% to income tax and persons earning $40,000 – $65,000 paid 45% to income tax! You like that? Oh, and of course we would all have to pay 21% in sales tax. And there’s also a healthcare tax taken out by your employer and sent to the government, the rate is 7.35%, taken right off the top before you see a dime of income! There’s your example of wonderful universal healthcare Libs. There’s more fees and taxes I could name, but point is, there’s no such thing as a free lunch.

      • Jim says:

        Yet Belgium has a HIGHER standard of living than we do even with those miserable taxes. Actually so does France,England and Germany, they’ve got immigrants. Japan and Canada also have a higher standard of living than we do. They’ve all got universal health care. The US is #19 on the list of countries with a high standard of living.

        http://www.businessinsider.com/19-countries-with-the-highest-standard-of-life-according-to-the-social-progress-report-2016-6/#2-canada-8949-for-such-a-huge-nation-canada-only-has-35-million-citizens-and-they-are-some-of-the-best-looked-after-in-the-world-canadas-healthcare-is-what-stands-it-above-the-rest-education-and-opportunity-in-the-country-are-also-impressively-strong-18

        Yes, Obamacare needs some improvements, however an improvement isn’t what they have in mind. The Republican motivation on repealing Obamacare is to provide a tax cut to the wealthy. It’s greed pure and simple.

        But don’t worry, they voted to exempt members of Congress from the cuts in health care.

        • Tina says:

          I guess this lie isn’t any worse than the many lies we were told when Democrats passed Obamacare…it is a lie none the less.

          The people that have been forced off of insurance under their employer and forced into a system with premiums and deductibles that make healthcare inaccessible to them have asked Republicans to rid us of Obamacare.

          The people in counties where their healthcare insurance company has dropped out of the system have asked Republicans to fix this disaster.

          Doctors who are working longer hours and spending fewer quality minutes with each patient are asking for relief from Obamacare.

          HOW DARE YOU!!! How dare you say that this is about putting money in the pockets of the rich.

          To imagine that the same progressive radicals in the /democrat Party that brought us Obamacare now offer a better alternative is absolutely nuts.

          To imagine that their talking points would be any more truthful than they were when they forced the ACA would also be nuts.

          What exactly constitutes a “higher standard of living?

          And which policies have brought the standard of living way down in America? Which party has controlled conditions over the last eight years?

          Costly Mistakes: How Bad Policies Raise the Cost of Living

          Polices under Obama have decimated the middle class in America and cause greater dependency on government, a false notion of well being and a huge indication of loss of opportunity.

          The problem with the left is they cannot, or will not, self criticize. They consider their policies are better because they think they are, not because of the results. They don’t bother to look at the damage they have done. Id just one child has been helped its a success even if millions of others are harmed.

          Here’s an idea…pack up and move to Belgium! Then the rest of us will have the freedom to create a higher standard of living…to make America great again!

        • Peggy says:

          Here’s a member of the House who stands in support of the health care bill passed today.

          GOP Rep. Who Lost Both Legs in Combat Takes House Floor & Goes NUCLEAR on Dems for Health Care ‘Lies’:

          “Rep. Brian Mast (R-FL) put his full support behind the GOP’s American Health Care Act during a scathing House floor speech on Thursday, accusing Democrats of “lying” about the legislation’s provisions on pre-existing conditions.

          Walking to the podium on two prosthetic legs, the Army veteran made his case for the AHCA.

          “I too am a person with pre-existing conditions. And I believe it’s not just something I should do, it’s a responsibility for me to be the staunchest advocate for people out there who have pre-existing conditions,” Mast said. “And that is why I am such an ardent supporter of this bill.”

          Mast argued that every American with a pre-existing condition should be asking themselves how they still have coverage as insurance providers continue to rapidly drop out of Obamacare.

          “Who is it that’s going out there and saying pre-existing conditions won’t be covered? It is the exact same group of people that went out there and lied to the face of every single American, telling them that if they like their plan, they would keep their doctor; if they like their doctor, they would keep their doctor,” Mast added. “That was a bald-faced lie.”

          Mast went as far as to allege the “architects” of Obamacare intended to “prey on the American people.”

          http://ijr.com/2017/05/864879-gop-rep-who-lost-both-legs-in-combat-takes-house-floor-goes-nuclear-on-dems-for-health-care-lies/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=Owned&utm_term=ijamerica&utm_campaign=ods&utm_content=Politics

        • Peggy says:

          Another liberal lie exposed.

          Jim: “But don’t worry, they voted to exempt members of Congress from the cuts in health care.”

          Republicans to Remove Exemption for Congress in Health Care Bill:

          http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/05/04/republicans-to-remove-exemption-for-congress-in-health-care-bill/

          H. R. 2192:
          “To amend the Public Health Service Act to eliminate the non-application of certain State waiver provisions to Members of Congress and congressional staff.”

          IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
          April 27, 2017

          https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-115hr2192ih/xml/BILLS-115hr2192ih.xml

  2. Tina says:

    John Merline uses Jimmy Kimmel’s screed as an example of how the left lies about healthcare:

    “Before 2014, if you were born with congenital heart disease like my son was, there was a good chance you would never be able to get health insurance because you were born with a pre-existing condition,” he said. “No parent should have to ever decide if they can afford to save their child’s life; it just shouldn’t happen, not here.”

    The clip immediately went viral, and Kimmel and his baby suddenly became the poster family for ObamaCare.

    Barack Obama tweeted: “Well said, Jimmy. That’s exactly why we fought so hard for the ACA, and why we need to protect it for kids like Billy. And congratulations!”

    President Trump’s Budget Director Mick Mulvaney was forced to respond to Kimmel, saying that “Everyone, I think, agrees with Jimmy Kimmel that we have enough money in this country to provide care for those type of folks.”

    What Kimmel left out of the story is the fact that most people on ObamaCare — in California and the rest of the country — are in highly restrictive HMO-type plans that wouldn’t let them go the hospitals or doctors he used.

    Kimmel’s wife gave birth at Cedars-Sinai Medical Center, a top-rated hospital in California with, as he noted, very attentive nurses and an outstanding pediatric emergency team.

    But only two ObamaCare plans include Cedars-Sinai in their provider networks — Blue Shield of California and Anthem Blue Cross. As the hospital website explains, only those enrolled in one of these two ObamaCare plans get “full coverage for care from Cedars-Sinai.”

    Data from Covered California — the state-run ObamaCare exchange — show that of the 1.3 million enrollees statewide, only about half signed up with one of these two plans. The rest would likely find Cedars-Sinai — where a maternity room can cost $4,000 a day — well out of their price range.

    Nor does every plan include Children’s Hospital of Los Angeles, where Kimmel’s baby was rushed to for open-heart surgery. Two, Molina and LA Care, didn’t list it on their websites.

    What’s more, a search of health plans offered through Covered California plans found only three that listed Dr. Vaughn Starnes — the cardiac surgeon whom Kimmel described as “world renowned” — on their provider networks. And one didn’t include him on the list of providers for their HMO plan. (These provider lists do, admittedly, have a tendency to be inaccurate.)

    This is the problem with ObamaCare that its backers — and everyone eagerly sharing Kimmel’s story — keep ignoring.

    In order to keep costs down in the midst of ObamaCare’s overwhelming number of regulations and benefit mandates, insurers drastically tightened up their provider networks. By January of last year, half of ObamaCare plans were HMO plans or “exclusive provider networks.” This year, 75% of ObamaCare plans in 18 states have narrow networks.

    As the New York Times explains, one way plans can save money is to “make it harder for patients to get care — so that they get less of it. Narrow network plans may do this if they don’t cover enough nearby providers, with the ones they do cover too busy to take new patients in a timely fashion.”

    So yes…the American people are asking the Republicans they elected and placed in power to rid this nation of the very destructive Obamacare…and lies will not change the fact that it is sorely needed.

    PS. The money that will no longer be taken from the rich is not a “payment” from the poor to them.

  3. Jim says:

    Tina: “Here’s an idea…pack up and move to Belgium!”

    You and Jack are always complaining about the oppressive government here in California. So perhaps you should pack up and move to Texas, Florida or wherever you feel the government is better.

    You know, if I was younger I might consider moving to Europe. I’m too old for that now, 17 months until I qualify for medicare. That is if the Republicans don’t screw that up too.

    • Post Scripts says:

      Jim, it may surprise you, but I’ve thought about moving, unfortunately at my age I can’t, that door has closed. My family is here, I’m too old to move, voting with my feet is no longer an option. Instead we tried to make a difference right here, and for a time we did, CA was tops in everything. But, the demographics slowly changed and with that our government. Too many dimwits came here looking for a free ride. And because they eventually outnumbered the intelligent and industrious people, the takers won and this was such a windfall for the democrats! Giveaways, entitlements…it worked Jim, you won!

      So, now we have too many takers to support this bloated bureaucracy without tax hikes every 20 minutes. Meanwhile, during this pillaging, this travesty, our crime went up almost as fast as education went down…. did you notice that? No, probably not. It’s ok Jim, being oblivious is one of the requirements for being a liberal. Now our state sucks. Our taxes are skyrocketing and yet the state is still falling apart. Democrats did that.

    • Tina says:

      I too have thought of leaving CA but at my age, and with my physical limitations, the thought of leaving is exhausting. Some of my kids have an actual plan to get out. One is already living elsewhere.

      We worked hard and planned well for our future so I can live comfortably in CA but our kids are finding it hard to justify staying when the cost of living here is so high and job opportunities have been scant.

      As for moving to Europe you might find a home there but you’ll also find some of the same problems we have here in CA/US plus several more and for the same reasons.

      The standard of living decline i the US tracks with the increase in European style socialist programs and immigration problems.

      • Post Scripts says:

        “Historically, whenever the Belgian government has looked to raise extra revenue from its citizens, the tendency has been to focus on payroll and indirect taxes, hence the very high levels of earned income taxes and VAT. It has also led to some of the more bizarre taxes, such as the tax on mortgage loans (how is it possible to pay tax on money that isn’t yours?). Due to the debt crisis, which has affected Belgium particularly badly, the amount of extra revenue the Belgian government has to find is of a magnitude that would be unrealistic to collect from raising what are already among the highest payroll taxes in Europe. Hence the growing expectation that the 2012 budget would represent a radical departure from the past as the Belgian government looked to more affluent sections of society to find extra revenue.” Encyclopedia Belgium

        • Libby says:

          It’s 2017, Jack. And they are still plugging away.

          It’s simply a question of what you want to do. And, alas, we know what you want to do, greedy, selfish Republicans that you are.

      • Jim says:

        I’m fully aware that European countries have problems too. I have a friend who is a French citizen and she is living in Chico. She and here family don’t like all the Muslims that have “taken over some French cities.” Another friend who lives in Austria is appalled at all the refugees and that some police now carry machine guns. Another friend decided to leave the US a few years ago. He lived in Austria for a while, liked it until until the refugee crisis. However he also found that it’s hard to get a good job as a foreigner. So he is now living in Tunisia, and likes it there. Got a better paying job too.

        I guess the grass always seems “greener” elsewhere. Everyplace has it’s own unique problems, it’s what we get accustomed to and learn to live with.

        With all the complaining I do about our local and state government, Chico is a nice place to live, and I with all it’s problems I still think that overall, California is the best deal in the world.

  4. Libby says:

    How about Germany, then? They are up to their armpits in Syrian refugees … and they manage.

    Tina, you are selfish and other things, and when push comes to shove … you just don’t want to sit in the waiting room with the brown people. And you really ought to be ashamed … any Christian would be.

    • Post Scripts says:

      Libby in Germany it may feel like they are up to their armpits in Syrian refugees, because of the new crime and terrorism, but in truth they only have about 360,000. On a per capita basis compared to the illegals in the USA, that’s a drop in the bucket.

      • Libby says:

        Jack, your math is beyond bogus. Germany’s immigrant population is near 30 percent … ours is under 10 percent. I can’t fathom why it is that you are not ashamed. Particularly in that our under 10 percent are employed, where Germany’s refugee population have got to learn the language first.

        We have Spanish-speaking labor organizers (Republicans to a man) all geared up and ready to exploit!

        Stuff it, Jack, … just stuff it.

    • Tina says:

      Libby you are not only a liar, you are profoundly wrong. Sad to say, when cornered you are a nasty individual who turns to the race card because you can’t quite justify or explain the destruction in your wake. If it makes you feel better to imagine me as something I am not have at it. Sticks and stones old girl, sticks and stones.

      The countries you, and Jim, have named as bastions of fabulous living are not as fabulous as you imagine. You’re as blind to the problems those nations have as you are blind to the problems in the U.S., and to the solutions. What’s more, you are particularly blind to the fact that you and your socialist anti-business policies with their attendant high taxes and growing dependency rolls are the cause of many of the problems and woes both in Europe and here at home.

      Germany’s economy is not that great. Angela Merkel thought Syrian refugees would solve her aging population problems. She needed workers to pay for all of that social engineering. Rather than being selective and smart, she opened the gates of hell and the problems that came with it are harming Germany and all of her neighbors. France’s economic woes aren’t any better. Charles Riley at CNN reports, Europe is Falling Apart. Saving it won’t be easy

      Until you people figure out that the enemy is not money, profit, or wealthy people you will fail to get how money is simply a tool for progress. Left in the hands of ordinary free people it creates abundance and better conditions for all…the poorest because of the charitable hearts of those who are no longer struggling to “get by” but find they have extra to share and because of the hearts and charity of those who have been particularly blessed and wish to share the blessing in profound ways…like building a new cancer wing at a hospital.

      Sharing…not forced taxation!

    • Tina says:

      Thought I could take the high road but on second thought…you insult not just me but my entire family which includes white folk, American Indian folk, black folk, Mexican folk, and Taiwanese folk so shut your mean spirited trap and look for a new (pathetic) excuse!

  5. TruthToPower says:

    LOL you guys are funny

    The USA pays more for less healthcare in the end.

    Fascism is here enjoy! I think we need to cut all social security, vets free stuff, and medicare.

    Time for cons to practice what they preach and get off the gov dole.

    Vets were paid and signed up. They should only get benefits when we are in a war for the defense of the country, not offense for corporate profit.

    Time to practice what you preach.

  6. Pete says:

    I don’t know why everyone is so amped up over this issue. The bill probably won’t pass the senate in its current form. It will be rewritten and sent back to the house. If finally past by both houses we’ll find out what works well and what doesn’t. I’m surprised that Republicans have allowed for any health care bill. I thought they would have just repealed and not replaced.

    • Chris says:

      Well, at least the GOP finally found their death panels. They just had to look in the mirror.

      • Post Scripts says:

        Universal healthcare is a monumental challenge and it’s expensive. People should not be forced to do what the government feels is best for them, so right there socialized medicine and our democracy are at odds. We also don’t like taxing the poor for 30% of their income like they do in parts of Europe. Chris, how does your comment help, other than gratifying yourself?

        • TruthToPower says:

          universal healthcare is more cost effective and saves money. Jeeze you are saying that the extreme salaries, and investor profits is cost effective? Really?

          LOL

          Health System Modernization Will Reduce the Deficit

          In the long term it will cost less with a small investment in the short term

          • Tina says:

            Please explain how universal healthcare is more cost effective. You do not get to claim this without demonstrating you know how it would work to drive costs down. Details please.

      • Post Scripts says:

        “Death panels?” lol

  7. TruthToPower says:

    yes Death panels… The States Gov……..

    Of course they will not pass this through the Senate they see their last days in elected office ahead.

    This bill even guts medicaid…LOL …. I was waiting to see the eviction of those in nursing homes on the news. Seniors in the streets in their last years…LOL

    I think that we should encourage them to pass the bill and stop this crap.

    Let the loyal Republicans have their way. Then we can send both the GOP and DNC packing.

    Forget all this anti single payer bull, they are wrong, the real facts are out there. In the end those who have what we ask for are selfish. We need to take it away from them before they care about others.

    So I am for gutting all of their social se urity, healthcare, non defense war bebfits, all of it.

    Let them live like those they wish harm to.

    • Tina says:

      Do you work, Dewey? Do you pay into the SS and Medicare? Have you figured out yet how much of pay you will give up to these systems over your lifetime? Or are you taking money under the table? And if you are paying in, are you claiming that when the time comes you will refuse to take whatever Social Security is owed to you? Are you likewise prepared to stand by your convictions and refuse to accept Medicare?

      Most of us, if not all, had nothing to do with creating these programs. We are required to pay into them. Until the law is changed we will participate at the back end…and you will too when the time comes…don’t even try to lie about it.

  8. TruthToPower says:

    President Trump is right. The Australian health care system provides health care to all of its people at a fraction of the cost than we do.

    • Post Scripts says:

      The United States ranks 7th for having the best doctors, Australia is not among the top ten nations. France was rated as number one. “They use a combination of private and public coverage, and nearly everyone in France has health insurance. Most people in France have additional private insurance, and almost all medical bills in France are covered by the government. France has one of the top rankings when it comes to efficiency in spending on medical care, which allows the government to pay around seventy percent of all medical bills. Perhaps the most telling statistic is that France is reported to have the lowest amount of deaths that could have been prevented with basic medical insurance of any country. France spends more on healthcare than any other European country, but they still spend less than the US does.”

  9. Tina says:

    An article from the pre-Obamacare debate takes on “Myths About Socialized Medicine”

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